Here is an eye-opening note on policing and policing reform, from a copper:

"Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo" (rustyvandura)
08/27/2020 at 15:22 • Filed to: None

!!! UNSUPPORTED LINE BREAK IN HEADER !!!

A couple weeks ago I got a long, thoughtful email from a law man explaining that when we talk about “police reform” we’re reducing to shorthand a subject that is incredibly complicated. I want to share his thoughts with you, but he asked me to keep his name out of it, so we’ll just call him !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! :

I am a peace officer who was in uniformed patrol for the last twelve years before transitioning to a weird, specialty law enforcement job (at a great time, too!) that has given me time to reflect upon patrol work. It’s like waking up slowly from a strange dream.

There is a widespread assumption that police administrators would fire incompetent officers if not for the powerful police unions. This is . . . an incomplete picture at best. It’s almost impossible to generalize about policing in America. In California, where I work, police officers make a good middle-class income. I have a friend who worked for New Orleans PD who told me they started at $17/hr, and he knew cops who were single moms who were on food stamps. In the same way, police unions have a wide range of sway over police administrators in different parts of the country.

There are incentives for police administrators to retain incompetent officers that have nothing to do with unions. A police department is a hungry beast that needs to be fed cops regularly. When economic times are good, no one wants to be a police officer. There is better money to be made without the lifestyle downsides that come with police work. Inevitably, departments start to drop well below their “minimum” staffing. In my area, many departments are 25-30% below minimum. I know of one big-city division that used to staff 9 officers on patrol. The minimum staffing was revised down to 6 due to the general lack of cops. When people are sick or on vacation, they will go as low as 4. Needless to say, their response time isn’t stellar.

I saw this dynamic play out during my career. When I was hired, shortly before the mortgage meltdown, people thought I was crazy to go into policing. I was able to land a job with my preferred agency, but I would have been able to get a position elsewhere. My agency paid my way through the academy and supplied all of my equipment. While there weren’t as many candidates due to the good economy, my agency was still able to be choosy as it was nearly fully staffed.

Once the Great Recession hit, there was a sudden interest in policing. My agency had its pick of candidates who had put themselves through the academy. The overall quality of candidates improved. When the rare lemon was hired, I witnessed unsuitable trainees getting fired during training for poor performance.

The latest economic boom coincided with a shortage of officers due to a previous hiring freeze. The quality and depth of the applicant pool was greatly diminished, and we were in the midst of a large wave of retirements.

By this point, I was a training officer. I saw my recommendations to remove unsuitable trainees for performance that had been unacceptable to that point ignored. The attitude of the command was that—barring any illegal behavior—trainees could be “fixed” later. This proved overly optimistic. It is very difficult to fix poor character or decision making.

I understand the administration’s quandary. They need cops. It takes about 9 months from the time of a retirement until a trainee is in the academy. Our academy is 6 months. My agency had an extra-long, nearly 6 month field-training phase. So after almost 2 years, to be told the appropriately $100,000 spent on hiring and training this person-who you hand picked was all for naught? That is a bitter pill to swallow. The sunk-cost fallacy is overwhelming at that point.

All of this goes back to what I wrote at !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! following the killing of George Floyd: We have a number of overlapping problems and solving them requires identifying them, disentangling them, addressing them individually.

One more note of interest from Jonah Hex:

COVID has had an impact in cop world. The Officer Down Memorial Page tracks line-of-duty deaths. I often used it with my trainees to show them that cars were as dangerous as guns to cops. Here is the current year page: .

There are currently 82 COVID deaths listed. Last I checked, there were no NYPD deaths listed, but about 30 NYPD cops have died from COVID. These are duty related. I know of two Riverside County, CA deputies who died of COVID the same week. Only one was duty related, and that is the only one listed on ODMP. For perspective, 145 officers died in 2019. If you take 5/12 of that (equal to the pandemic so far) that is about 60. COVID has far more than doubled the risk of being a cop.

Given the impact on older officers, I predict a lot of extra retirements this year. When policing is slightly less popular than a violent bout of food poisoning, I don’t see a lot of volunteers to take their places.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

The idea that COVID could kill more officers in the line of duty this year than all other causes of death is pretty striking.

Also striking: After this year, think about the kind of people who would really want to become cops. I can think of two general types: Those who want to fix law enforcement and those who like what they’ve seen.

I suspect the latter group might be larger than the former.

DISCUSSION (94)

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:35

My friend in Honolulu is a cop and I know a sergeant at SFPD. I did the test and a few ride alongs in SF when I first moved here to see if I was interested. Holy crap do SFPD babysit lunatics and drug addicts all night, I just thought this would ruin me so I didn’t do it. We drove down the street and he pointed out people by name, he said they just have to keep tabs on them or they would be arrested every night for drugs, they can’t do much about that. My wife didn’t want me to do a job with guns again anyway. Without those ride alongs my opinion might be pretty different.

Deal Killer - Powered by Focus > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:35

Personal opinion, the local PD should rarely, if ever, hire ex-military as police officers.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:39

It may be outside of his experience, but in Houston, it’s common for officers to take side jobs to make ends meet. Most are security related. While on these jobs, the officers are technically off-duty, but they are often in uniform, so they are operating in a grey area. My uncle took it a bit further and had a second job as an insurance agent.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:49

My co-worker’s husband is about to leave the force after 10 years.

I don’t blame him.

Merkin Muffley > Deal Killer - Powered by Focus
08/27/2020 at 15:49

Not sure why you’d say that. The level of training, the discipline and the amount of safety proficiency with firearms is far higher with the ex-military guys. They are less likely to get rattled, better under pressure and just generally more composed in confusing situations.

The vast majority of these excessive force cases involve non-ex-military guys... usually it’s a local f uc k-up with no prospects in life and a chip on their shoulder to go with the badge . That’s the summary on that Dickhead in Minnesota and this guy in Kenosha. Guys that never should have made it through the academy.

Anybody that’s interacted with CBP versus local police always comes away impressed w ith the level of professionalism of CBP. They recruit almost exclusively from ex-military men and women.

Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle > 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)
08/27/2020 at 15:51

Pretty strong argument for dispatches social workers and medical personnel if you ask me. My wife is a social worker who worked in a mobile unit(Emt and social worker in every van) dispatched by 911 for non violent misdemeanors. We moved so she no longer does it but the people you describe are e xactly the type of people they could triage more effectively and for less money than the cops with a lower danger all around. It’s too bad the movement for these kinds of services is considered divisive(mostly due to the name) because it’s a better model from many aspects.

Sovande > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:53

Peace officer. That takes balls. Peacefully kneeling on a motherfuckers neck til he stops breathing. Peacefully shooting a guy 7 times while his kids watch. Peacefully choking a guy to death for selling cigarettes. Peacefully s hooting an unarmed kid who has is hands up.

I am sure your friend is a good person who is well-intentioned with a sense of civic duty. Unfortunately he works for a paramilitary organization that is armed to the teeth and has a penchant for killing minorities all in the name of peace keeping.

ttyymmnn > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:53

That 17yo kid who killed two people in Kenosha idolized the police. He probably would have been a cop someday, and he might have started killing people legally. How much mental screening goes into getting hired? But as the author says, there is a shortage of new cops, so they’ll either take what they can get or keep on cops that are not fit for the job.

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 15:59

I think paying officers more to attract higher quality recruits is a legitimate option. But yo u have to be careful because that money would be wasted if you allow existing low quality officers (not the entirety of the force of course) to select recruits that they see as “like them”. You risk ending up with people who are just as bad, at higher cost.

Sovande > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 15:59

That’s just a ton of generalizations.

When you enter the military you train for war. Your duty will be to go to foreign lands and kill the enemy. Policing should not be about finding and killing the enemy. Police are supposed to protect and serve. The only similarity between a cop and soldier should be that they both know how to shoot a gun. Nothing more.

What is the CBP?

My bird IS the word > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 16:01

You gotta think about what kind of person is attracted to that type of job. I have met very few officers "just doing their job". Either super great guys or total dickheads. Not a lot of middle ground.

CB > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 16:04

My concern is that, by putting a divide between the police and the public (Sir Robert Peel would have a field day with this) the kind of people who should be cops won’t want to become cops (diverse communities, cooler heads, people with local knowledge, people who know multiple languages, people with work experience or higher education) . The people who really shouldn’t be cops, those who have power fantasies, gun fetishes, knuckledraggers, are going to be the ones applying. It’ll be a feedback loop of awful.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 16:04

To add to this...the military has stricter rules of engagement than most police departments do.

My bird IS the word > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 16:05

Name a profession that is free of crime.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 16:06

I agree that PDs shouldn’t be un able to hire ex-military, but the discipline and training required of soldier isn’t the same as what’s required for police. That, and the fact that many, many, many veterans return from deployment with PTSD or one of many other mental illnesses that go largely untreated. In general, PDs should provide (and to some level, require) mental health evaluations and treatment for officers.

Sovande > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 16:06

Explain how that exercise would be relevant?

CB > Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle
08/27/2020 at 16:06

The thing is, due to cutting of funding for social services, deinstitutionalization of mental health asylums (fair, they weren’t great in the 70s), to just scratch the surface, means that a lot of things that should not be policing issues are now policing issues.

CB > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 16:09

Under the Canadian Criminal Code, police officers fall under the umbrella of peace officers. That also includes border services officers, correctional staff (if I remember correctly), some by-law officers, conservation officers, park rangers, oceans and fisheries officers, et cetera.

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle
08/27/2020 at 16:09

Since then I do see mobile bathrooms and some workers at these stations. I’m not sure they have all the services they need. I see people with little or no connection to reality and I doubt they will go to one of those. The whole model we have been using does seem crazy.

Chariotoflove > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 16:13

Same in Dallas. DPD officers are frequently hired to direct traffic at private events, etc.

Deal Killer - Powered by Focus > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 16:13

Some people who are used to having orders obeyed, may be less likely to be OK with a “civilian” not complying with an order. I admit I may be mistaken, but it seems like a lot of cops think they are to be obeyed without question. I have the right to ask an officer why I’m being detained, arrested or otherwise delayed in my going about my business.

Just as an FYI, if you an abbreviation, explain what it is. CPB is??

haveacarortwoorthree2 > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 16:14

I know officers in Houston and Dallas. All of them that I know (admittedly, a limited subset) work side jobs not “to make ends” meet but because they can rake in some serious cash doing so. That’s not to say there are not some doing so because they need to, but I would guess a significant number falling into that category are because of personal choices (large family, expensive tastes, etc.), not crappy pay.

https://www.hpdcareer.com/benefits.html

haveacarortwoorthree2 > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 16:15

Customs and Border Patrol

My bird IS the word > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 16:23

Why would you expect any law enforcement effort to be free of crime, simply because it's end goal is law enforcement? Where better for a psychopath to hide? What is the alternative to law enforcement?

Sovande > haveacarortwoorthree2
08/27/2020 at 16:24

Oh, right.

That's a fun organization. They militarized the border and now, instead of 10 people dying every year in the desert trying to cross the border, it's 1000. Maybe they need more guns.

Sovande > CB
08/27/2020 at 16:25

Nobody is talking about Canada. Usually ever.

koawaft1 > Deal Killer - Powered by Focus
08/27/2020 at 16:31

As someone that has worked with lots of police officers and deputies. It is a little more complicated but I understand the concerns. First your numbers would go way down there are many former military. Staffing that is already a challenge would be a nightmare. Some of them I worked with you would absolutely want those ithose with with military experience tobbe in tough situations because they have seen worse and delt with it in such a way you want them doing it more. But yes sometimes you get “wants to fight” person that just wants to be in those situations for the wrong reasons.

Our local police department made the change from a drill sergeant type academy to kinder gentler academy. I get the idea of it but I th ink it was counter productive for some. You don’t want the first time someone is yelled, at treated like garbage, etc to be when they are on the street. Many learn to not react to provication in the military type academy which is good! A lso were is the line drawn? No national guard? The plane mechanic in the Air Force?

Sovande > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 16:41

I never said I had that expectation. My expectation would be that if a guy commits a crime, say trying to pass a fake $20 bill , that the police response should be something less than killing the guy on the spot.

If it happened once, it’s a psycho. If it happens over and over again at a systemic level, it’s time to reassess. Police forces were established to capture runaway slaves and then they transitioned to enforcing Jim Crow laws to keep black men incarcerated.

Modern policing is based on an economic system. Here it is plainly: After the Civil War, southern states no longer had a source of free labor, but they did have the 13 th Amendment which allowed them to incarcerate black men and then simply force them to work in prison, thus effectively getting free labor. Jim Crow laws kept this up until 1965. Man walked on the moon 4 years later.

I don’t have a solution, I’m still wrapping my head around the problem. I know the solution isn’t saying “well, there are bad apples in every profession.”

DipodomysDeserti > 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)
08/27/2020 at 16:47

he said they just have to keep tabs on them or they would be arrested every night for drugs

In Phoenix they just keep arresting them every day, sometimes multiple times a day if they get arraigned early enough. Guess that’s what happens when you have a couple of big, county-run jails to lock people up in.

My bird IS the word > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 16:48

So its a scale problem then? How many accidental deaths/murders are acceptable then? Less unarmed black men were killed last year than people killed by being struck by lightning.

https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-victims

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > DipodomysDeserti
08/27/2020 at 16:51

Yeah in Hawaii I know they send people to the Tent City in AZ, we don’t have much prison space . I went to NAU and I heard about it there too. I guess it’s a big outdoor camp? A lot of the addicts here are not very mobile he said, they rarely go more than a few blocks.

DipodomysDeserti > CB
08/27/2020 at 16:51

Same issues here in America, except that the War on Drugs makes it policing issue even if we had proper social services.

Mercedes Streeter > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 16:53

Hey now, I don’t commit any crimes when fixing computers!

(Or do I? *shifty eyes*)

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)
08/27/2020 at 16:57

“ I’m not sure they have all the services they need.”

I can 100% guarantee that they don’t.

Even in housing (my sector) people who work for community development agencies are working case loads that are 3-4 times what they should be to be effective. It’s tragic.

My bird IS the word > Mercedes Streeter
08/27/2020 at 16:59

Cyber crime is for cool kids only

Kinja'd!!!

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 16:59

Seal clubbing

DipodomysDeserti > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 17:00

CBP is a lot stricter in their hiring practices than police agencies. I have a friend (Marine, multiple tours, worked as a private contractor for the CIA in Afghanistan, highly trained) who was not hired by CBP (he was dealing with pretty severe PTSD at the time), but was hired by an SD. He’s now made their SWAT and is doing a lot better than he was, and hasn’t done anything shitty.

Another friend was fired from CBP (no one knows what he did, but it had to be pretty severe), only to be hired by a local PD. Ended up killing a guy his first month on his beat with no witnesses. Kid was a Marine sniper and was apart of taking Fallujah. Nice guy if you know him, but a deeply disturbed and scary individual, who holds some deep seated hatred for people of a certain ethnicity and religion.

Mercedes Streeter > ttyymmnn
08/27/2020 at 17:00

He probably still will be a police officer one day . While a big city department may not hire him for his record (prior to killing two people he already had a mark for illegally firing a gun) a small town with a shortage of cops may turn the other chee k and let him in.

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > Deal Killer - Powered by Focus
08/27/2020 at 17:01

I’ll meet you halfway and say: most emergency calls shouldn ’t be responded to by p olice, but rather social workers, paramedics, or detectives. Police who have combat training have a place, it’s just a very narrow one.

fintail > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 17:07

But whatabout!

CompactLuxuryFan > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 17:07

People would be thrilled if the amount of police murders were maintained but police officers faced consequences at nearly the same rate as the general population committing crime , never mind black people in low income communities .

And we do already know what alternatives to law enforcement are because wealthy communities already enjoy low policing of crimes such as drug poss ession and white collar crime such as wage theft while pumping resources into safety nets, education, and recreational infrastructure .

DipodomysDeserti > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 17:08

In Phoenix, a group of cops were ripping off a local developer by skipping out on paid security work. A cop being investigated ended up being found dead with a shotgun blast to the head. It was eventually ruled a suicide, but many (including family and coworkers) believe he was murdered. He had two sidearms on him, but for some reason decide to shoot himself with a shotgun.

DipodomysDeserti > CB
08/27/2020 at 17:08

This is exactly what has happened in many cities in the US.

ttyymmnn > Mercedes Streeter
08/27/2020 at 17:12

If he’s convicted of first degree murder, which is the charge against him, he might be in jail for a long time. I hope so.

fintail > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 17:15

I suspect 90% of the real difficulties of being a LEO are linked to defunding the mental health system and the further stripping of the safety net given to us by the brave warriors in the GOP who passed the savings on to those who deserve it least.

I’m very skeptical about not pointing a finger police unions - as their rules indeed do protect the bad seeds. The rarity of a bad actor receiving real punishment needs to be reformed. Some of the bennies are also a bit much, at least locally. Don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t want the job even at the healthy pay most receive locally, and most of my interactions with LEOs have been positive, but the bad apples need to be ousted and the fratbro-like system that protects them needs to be torn down.

The so-called right is all for union-busting, but they won’t touch the praetorians, that says a lot for me.

Here’s a fun recent incident in Seattle, no doubt some paid vacation will result:

https://www.heraldnet.com/northwest/seattle-officer-on-leave-over-comments-conduct-at-protest/

Moronic triggered snowflakes like this dipshit don’t help, either:

https://www.king5.com/article/news/local/port-of-seattle-police-officer-paid-leave-facebook-post-stay-at-home-order/281-cd847809-e7be-44da-8606-ae6c13e029ce

Both of these seem like the type who’d also have an itchy trigger finger.

fintail > DipodomysDeserti
08/27/2020 at 17:16

You know someone’s making money via that revolving door, “creating jobs”, too.

fintail > CB
08/27/2020 at 17:17

Yeah, DD beat me to it - that scenario has already played out.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 17:18

9 minutes is not accidental. 7 times in the back is not accidental. Breaking open the door of the wrong house and then on top of that shooting a woman while she slept was not accidental.

Lightning is not human. This is a shitty analogy.

jminer > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 17:34

CBP is one of the most violent and corrupt police forces in the US. Partially from inception but also continues very much to the modern day.

https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-behind-the-bastards-29236323/episode/part-one-the-us-border-patrol-69755319/

They have the advantage of being able to deport victims as well as most courts enforce few of the traditional due process rights afforded to us when it comes to immigrants.

Merkin Muffley > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 17:42

Customs and Border Patrol.

Most of the hires also have MP experience and training. Better training than the civilian recruits. This is pretty well documented

Merkin Muffley > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker
08/27/2020 at 17:45

That’s kind of a stereotype but the military command doesn’t want wacky guys getting access to automatic weapons, explosives and tactical gear either. Their mental health screening is very thorough.

An MP discharged honorably is almost always a credit to a force lucky enough to recruit her

Merkin Muffley > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s
08/27/2020 at 17:46

And the training in discipline to adhere to the ROE.

Merkin Muffley > Deal Killer - Powered by Focus
08/27/2020 at 17:49

Most of the CBP recruits are also former MPs. “Customs and Border Patrol”

I always figure they get recruited into forces like Santa Monica to hear the old guard claim “LA is like a war zone”.

“ that’s funny dude. I did three tours in the sandbox and one in Kandahar. Trust me, Marina Del Rey is NOT a war zone....”

Merkin Muffley > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 17:51

There’s a funny storyline in Bosch where Jerry the partner is getting pressure from his wife to quit LAPD to focus on selling real estate full-time.

“Better money. Better hours. Less likely to get shot at..."

Merkin Muffley > DipodomysDeserti
08/27/2020 at 17:51

Wow.

Sovande > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 17:51

Effective in running immigrants through privatized “detention centers” and tr eating them just exactly like human chattel, yes. They get paid to lock people up. There are like 400 immigration detention centers in this country. Before they were privatized we only needed five. But keep up the good work CBP. Just another person held long enough in detention to trigger a payout from the federal government to the holding facility, then send them back over to start the whole process over.

My bird IS the word > AMGtech - now with more recalls!
08/27/2020 at 20:12

Nitpick my word choice if you will, the point is when you have hundreds of millions of people, you are bound to have at least several tradgedies per year.

And for the record, after watching the videos I think the Blake shooting was 100% justified.

Taylor Martin > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 20:48

So right now we’re facing a pretty big brunt of the unqualified or unsuited trainees who may, later on in their career, change their ways. These are the people in question when saying “All Cops Are Bad,” but that doesn’t mean they are all bad. There’s of fine people, good people, who genuinely want to help and make their communities better. But the system they work for is a system that was originally meant to catch slaves. It’s not that the people are bad (though there are some who are), it’s that the system itself needs to change. It’s outdated, it’s overly funded, and because of the mass fluctuations between qualified cops and unsuited trainees, it’s clear that changes in the hiring process have to be made. Cops are trained to use a gun, handle high pressure situations, and know the law in 2 years. They handle too many things, and the idea of what a cop should do needs to be simplified. The roles they perform should be spread out into other professions. H aving more support lines for drug addicts or counselors for domestic abuse cases will drastically help, it’s the little things that need to be addressed by more people than just cops as a whole. I wish there weren’t so many power hungry people in the world who turn to the police academy to fuel their fetish... hell, I wish there weren’t so many power hungry people in general.

Also, the phrase “Can You Breath?” always rubbed me as a bit satirical and rude. It’s as if you were saying “Can you breath? Then why are you worried about if he can breath?” I don’t think that’s the intention... I sure hope it’s not.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 21:24

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/07/15/border-patrol-trump-administration-227357

Not the greatest bar, when CBD had to change their defintion of corruption.

“ The situation continued to deteriorate as the Obama administration went on. A CATO Institute study found that from 2006 to 2016, CBP and the Border Patrol’s misconduct and disciplinary infractions outstripped all other federal law enforcement. Border Patrol agents were six times as likely as FBI agents to be fired for disciplinary infractions or poor performance and “12.9 times as likely as Secret Service agents.” Moreover, CATO found “it is virtually impossible to assess the extent of corruption or misconduct in U.S. Customs and Border Protection … because most publicly available information is incomplete or inconsistent.” As I totaled up in 2014, there were 2,170 misconduct arrests of CBP officers and agents—ranging from corruption to domestic violence from 2005 through 2012—meaning that one CBP officer or agent was arrested every single day for seven years.”

“ obscure government job descriptions and law enforcement responsibilities, negotiated in the abstract when DHS was being created, meant that Congress didn’t grant CBP the ability or authority to investigate its own employees. Whereas any even moderately sized local police department has an internal affairs department, the nation’s largest law enforcement agency had to refer all misconduct allegations to either the DHS inspector general, the FBI or ICE—all of which soon found themselves overwhelmed by the flood of CBP problems.”

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 21:48

Several. Yes. Absolutely. Not decades worth of unpunished systemic racism. White person gets killed by a cop, that cop is in jail the next day. Black person gets killed by a cop, that cop gets paid vacation. What in the actual fuck.

100%? I can see the argument for it, after reading through the 911 dispatch log , especially since the video isn’t clear and there’s no body cam. Maybe Blake did have a knife. Maybe it was just keys or maybe the cop was worried about the vehicle being used as a weapon. But it also wouldn’t be the first time cops said something (“I smell alcohol”, I smell marijuana”, “I saw a gun”, etc) to justify shooting or arresting. We don’t know. What we do know is that there were three officers right there attempting nothing in between verbal commands and shooting. That's like saying you're going to take up hiking, but have never done it before, then climbing Everest the next day. Why was there nothing in between? Why was there 7 shots? Fucking 7! No pepper spray? No second taser attempt? Well, I found 7 little tiny metallic flakes in your engine oil, time for a $15k crate motor. This is extreme.

DipodomysDeserti > Merkin Muffley
08/27/2020 at 22:18

Yeah, Phoenix PD is a very sketchy operation. Then we have MCSO who are pretty up front about their racism and militarization.

DipodomysDeserti > 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)
08/27/2020 at 22:25

We elected a new Sheriff a few years ago and he shut tent city down, so now they use the brand new jail that had been sitting empty. It was a big outdoor camp with Vietnam era military tents. TBH I would have rather been locked up there than in the indoor prison. At least you can see the sky.

I watched a kid get released, walk around the corner and pass out. He was high the whole time we were locked up (about fourteen hours) .

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > DipodomysDeserti
08/27/2020 at 22:38

I met a Hawaiian guy who had been there and he was like, oh yeah the blond haoles gotta go with the nazi dudes. Since then I thought hmm prison might be even worse if I have to go with those guys.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI
08/27/2020 at 22:57

Certainly narrower than their lane is currently.

My bird IS the word > AMGtech - now with more recalls!
08/27/2020 at 22:59

Saying that is a hard rule though, that every instance of shooting a black man isn’t punished and a white mans isnt supported. Even if it is commonplace, the records are all public. People vote. They can take an active role in their local comminities to insure administration officials are following policy. Cops have a tough job that has to be given some level of consideration or it just wouldnt be viable as a career. How much would you need to be paid to risk prison time for a life threatening event that maybe lasts 12 seconds? To suppose eliminating racism would suppose that we could eliminate assholes. If only that was so easy.

I don’t belive that the policies are the problem. I belive complience with those policies is. Same thing with bad HOAs. The lack of concern and engagement of residents allows it to flourish.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 23:01

How’s the weather?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 23:02

Name a profession that arms the employees and licenses them to kill.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Sovande
08/27/2020 at 23:03

As a citizen of the United States, in the year 2020, may I go on record as saying that this would not be without its merits?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 23:05

I just have trouble seeing how cops shooting unarmed suspects in the back can be compared to some other profession.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ttyymmnn
08/27/2020 at 23:08

Well, this post certainly brought a lot of discussion. The protesters burn s**t down. I’m not hearing about them shooting people, other than a couple of cases when someone had a beef with someone.

ttyymmnn > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:09

Meanwhile, in Austin...

https://www.kxan.com/news/crime/apd-investigating-fatal-shooting-in-downtown-austin/

TheRealBicycleBuck > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:09

It’s actually decent right now. Warm and muggy as usual with scattered clouds. I can see the brightest stars. This weekend will have some cleanup work around the house, but overall, not bad.

How are things in CA?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 23:11

Smokey. Though yesterday and last night were beautiful. Today was good as well. low- to mid-60s at night. Open the windows, turn on a fan, pull up the blanket, snuggle up. Livin’ the dream.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:13

Open a window here and you’ll have a house full of mosquitoe s. What did you end up doing for a filter?

My bird IS the word > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:13

Abortion clinicians?

My bird IS the word > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI
08/27/2020 at 23:14

I'm not sure if that is a joke or not, but I laughed.

My bird IS the word > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:17

Its a unique profession with unique risks to both cops and to criminals/civilians. Its possible to be concerned with lives without wanting to burn the whole system to the ground just to replace it with a nearly identical one.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 23:22

Filter?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 23:24

I am certainly not proposing that. Fewer cops and more social workers, perhaps, or, as they do in England, have half the force be community service officers.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word
08/27/2020 at 23:25

I can think of one or two reasons why this would make a ridiculous comparison. But I think it a bit unimaginative, generally.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > AMGtech - now with more recalls!
08/27/2020 at 23:29

I’m like, show me a video of a white man being shot in the back by police. What, having trouble finding any?

But correlation DNE causation, right?

Conveniently, Constitutional originalism achieves all the racist aims without being racist.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:29

I had in mind california and smoke and I was thinking that it was you looking for a filter to clear out the smoke in your house. It wasn’t. It was 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°). https://oppositelock.kinja.com/1844822773

I thought about moving out there one day. I’ve toured through part of the state and I really like it. Unfortunately, that’s not in the cards for me.

DipodomysDeserti > 415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)
08/27/2020 at 23:39

Yeah, Maricopa Co. jails are not a good place to be. The cartels have infiltrated the guards pretty effectively as well, which doesn’t help matters.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > TheRealBicycleBuck
08/27/2020 at 23:55

I like it here.

Beefchips > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/27/2020 at 23:59

This is very interesting, thank you for sharing! It’s easy to see from the outside the consequences, but very difficult people without direct experience to find the reasons why these consequences come about.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Beefchips
08/28/2020 at 00:04

The post certainly brought about lots of interesting discussion.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > My bird IS the word
08/28/2020 at 01:06

It’s more or less been a rule since the dawn of policing in the US. Most white people just weren’t aware until recently (maybe since Colin Kaepernick) how bad it is, and has always been. And now with cell phones being everywhere to catch this shit it’s all coming to the surface. But voting doesn’t mean shit when voter suppression and gerrymandering exist. Some levels of consideration, yeah absolutely. Not a fucking license to kill. Why aren’t Breonna Taylor’s killers locked up!? That case is cut and fucking dried. How much would I need to be paid? Honestly less than I make as a mechanic. But I’m not a piece of shit and wouldn’t fall in behind the thin blue line, so I’d be more worried about friendly fire than anything else.

Compliance is definitely an issue. As there doesn’t seem to be any. There needs to be oversight from a third party entity. They can’t investigate themselves. They need to be better trained. They need to stop "warrior training" and militarization. They need to stop seeing the public, especially non-white people, as the enemy. I'm not saying this to reduce white lives. I'm saying it to bring attention to the fact that right now, white and not-white lives are not equal in the eyes of the law. And that's fucked. The problem is deeply systemic and it dates back over a hundred years. Shit needs to change.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/28/2020 at 01:17

Fuck racists. But fuck me too if I don't try to show them why they're wrong.

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > My bird IS the word
08/28/2020 at 02:01

https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/sexual-and-reproductive-rights/abortion-facts/

https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/Issues/Women/WRGS/SexualHealth/INFO_Abortion_WEB.pdf

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/28/2020 at 02:05

The video quality is terrible so sorry in advance , but I think about this scene a lot.

BigBlock440 > AMGtech - now with more recalls!
08/28/2020 at 07:35

White person gets killed by a cop, that cop is in jail the next day.

This bullshit is why you don’t get more support. Do you have any instances of that happening? Because they’re plenty of instances of the opposite.

BigBlock440 > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/28/2020 at 07:43

I’m like, show me a video of a white man being shot in the back by police. What, having trouble finding any?

Doesn’t fit the narrative so they don’t make national news. But if you really want to see one, here:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/09/us/police-shooting-video-arizona.html

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > BigBlock440
08/28/2020 at 10:40

It just happened a few weeks ago . However, conveniently for you, I can’t find any stories about it since I don’t remember where it happened or names involved. Fine. Ignore that point. Why isn't there police oversight? Why are Breonna Taylor's killers free? I'm not advocating rioting, or complete dismantling of police. I'm advocating fairness, third party oversight, ending police militarization and warrior mentality, and an overhaul of the police system that would include more training, and replace cops with social workers for many homeless and mental illness calls. We need a police force. We just don't need them to kill as many people as they do, and we need unjustified killings to be handled fairly.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > BigBlock440
08/28/2020 at 16:03

That is horrible. He probably thought his pants were falling down. He couldn’t process the cops’ instructions. They fired the cop, even though he was acquitted of murder or manslaughter. But it fits my narrative: American policing has serious problems.